Testing Penta Water

Dear Dr. Gordon,

While I'm no fan of the "quack busting" activities of the "great" Randi, I do feel that health seekers who break free of useless/harmful therapies promoted by the orthodox medical establishment are vulnerable to some useless/harmful therapies or products promoted by the alternative healing establishment. Therefore, I was interested in an exchange between Randi and Mr. Holloway (founder of PentaWater) that I found while searching for information about PentaWater.

I've carefully excerpted important parts of the exchange below. Why would Mr. Holloway not participate in this test to demonstrate the validity of their claim that seeds germinate faster with PentaWater or that, as measured by the Bio Impedance Analyzer (the instrument of Mr. Holloway's choice), human cells hydrate better with PentaWater? This causes me to wonder whether ordinary purified or distilled or RO water might be just as effective as PentaWater and our money might better be spent elsewhere than on expensive PentaWater.

I'll be interested to hear your opinion about this.

>From the website of the "great" Randi:
the Penta people, on their web page, beneath a family picture of the founders, clearly assert that: At first, [the Penta engineers] tested Penta on plants. They discovered that test seeds would germinate in half the time as the control seeds. Bingo! Hallelujah! We have the means for a test! A simple, inexpensive, clearly demonstrative, test! Such a demonstration would clearly establish the claim these folks are making.

If you will supply sufficient Penta water for the tests, we can design a double-blind procedure for testing the Penta claim. Supervised independently and conducted entirely by a prominent university lab, a test would be performed in which volunteers would receive either Penta water, or ordinary water, and following their use of the water in accordance with your specific directions, the volunteers would be asked to evaluate what they received, without ANYONE knowing - until after the test - whether they received
Penta water, or the control samples. Your people would be the ones to interrogate all the volunteers to record their evaluations. This would be at no cost to you except that you would contribute the Penta water, so that there could be no doubt that the genuine product was being used by the laboratory. All persons involved would be persons 100% approved by you, and by the JREF.
You understand that the volunteers would not be aware of whether they received Penta water, or ordinary water, and the containers would all be identical except for coded markings which would, following the test procedures, be de-coded. Each individual volunteer would receive only Penta water, or ordinary water, all through the test period, and would be required to use it in accordance with your specific directions. You would be free to visit, question, and advise the volunteers at any time during the test period.

Mr. Holloway, it has been suggested by my staff that the "germination of seeds" effect mentioned by you would be a much more rapid, economical, and practical test of Penta. I will ask that you consider this possibility, as well. It would follow the lines of the previously-described tests, except that no human subjects would be required, and your team would of course be the sole decision-makers on whether or not the seeds had been treated with Penta or with ordinary tap-water. I think you can see how the protocol could be adapted easily. In addition, this test would take so little time perhaps only a few days - and there would be no concern about possible irregularities in applying the proper use of the water, a concern that certainly would be present if human subjects were to be depended upon to follow your directions in imbibing the water. A complete video record could easily be kept of the entire procedure used to produce germination of the seeds, adding to the data obtained and providing for both sides, further assurance of the integrity of the tests. Please let me have your thoughts on this.

Dear Mr.Randi: Thank you for your prompt response. We are evaluating your offer and will be in contact this coming week. We would be interested in the live human experiment not the seed experiment, as our process has been modified for human consumption. We would recommend the use of a Bio Impedance Analyzer, which is currently utilized by hospitals to evaluate cellular hydration. The Bio Impedance Analyzer is approved by the F.D.A. and would we feel meet with your approval. If you would like to learn more about Bio Impedance Analyzers go to rjlsystems.com we recommend this unit since it is F.D.A. approved and in use by major hospitals nationwide. In the mean time while we are developing our protocol and deciding if we will accept your challenge, we would like to send you some Penta water for you to try. This will give you a chance to see for yourself the effects of Penta water as it will only take a day for someone your age to feel the effects.

Mr. Holloway, examining the contents of your message:
>We would be interested in the live human experiment not the seed experiment, as our process has been modified for human consumption.< That is your choice, of course.
>We would recommend the use of a Bio Impedance Analyzer, which is currently utilized by hospitals to evaluate cellular hydration.< Very well. The experiment would then take the following form, subject to your approval and subject to any metabolic or other specific factors that might interfere, and of which I am unaware:
1. I propose that we select a group of 50 persons (subjects) for whom you believe the use of Penta water would be beneficial, in that it would increase their degree of cellular hydration.
2. An independent party (A) would obtain an adequate supply of Penta water and would decant this into 50 marked, coded, sterile containers, each container being adequate for a day's supply, and the codes being retained by yet another independent party, (B). Person A would then similarly prepare an equal number of identical marked, coded, sterile containers into which ordinary water would be placed. In the same way, B would retain the secret coding of those containers and would then retire from the proceedings. These 100 containers would then be mixed randomly, so that no observer would be able to tell - without breaking the code - whether he or she is holding a container of Penta water, or of ordinary water. All coding marks are to be fastened permanently on the containers, and masked securely by a simple means until the coding is broken by B in step The stock of containers would then be retained in security by an independent party, (C).
3. The 50 subjects would have their degree of cellular hydration measured and recorded by means of the BIA, and if you wished, you would question them as well. Each would then be given a container of water by C, in a coded container, each person to receive a container selected at random by C from the mixed supply. The remaining 50 containers would not be used, but would be kept securely isolated by C. Each subject would then be required to use the water in the manner approved and dictated by you. You understand that no person (subject, handler, or experimenter) would have any way of differentiating between the containers except by referring to and breaking the coding, or possibly by noticing the claimed beneficial effects of the Penta, if that was what they were given.
4. After a sufficient period has passed that in your opinion the effects of the Penta water, if any, should be evident, you will be asked to examine each of the subjects, question them if you wish, and use the BIA to determine the degree of cellular hydration of each of the 20 subjects. You would record the code-number of the water container each subject used, and place that data in the record.
5. You would then prepare a report based upon your own evaluation, and the input provided by the subjects themselves, making your final decision on whether or not each subject received Penta water or ordinary water. You would be free to disqualify any subject(s) for ANY reason you see fit.
6. When your report is complete, the person retaining the secret coding would be brought in, the coding would be revealed and broken, and a determination would be made of the contents of each of the containers used. Your evaluations would then be compared with the identification of the water used. We would expect that, for a "win" to be attained by you, your evaluation would agree with 37 or more out of the 50 subjects' actual usage -- making allowance for any subjects you might have chosen to disqualify. This would constitute the preliminary phase of your attempt for the JREF prize.
>The Bio Impedance Analyzer is approved by the F.D.A. and would we feel meet with your approval.
< Since the evaluation would be entirely in your hands, you would of course be free to use any and all means to determine whether or not any subject's degree of cellular hydration has been altered, so we are not concerned with these details. Please do not send me any product. I cannot be personally involved in this process, which should be in your hands and under your control as much as possible. Thank you.

Persons A, B, and C, must not be known to one another. We have procedures for maintaining security of the coding, in such a way that the coding cannot be altered, and cannot be "broken" even by the person retaining the information. Person A must perform his/her function, and then cease involvement in the procedure, to be called back in only if there is any doubt or problem with the process he/she carried out. Person B would not be made aware of what he/she in involved with, nor would that person communicate with anyone else concerning what has been done. Person C's only function would be to mix the 100 bottles randomly with the coding number out of sight, as described, and to distribute to each subject, at random, a container, then retain the 50 remaining containers securely and untampered Addendum: if you wish to shorten and simply this procedure, we would consider using only 20 subjects, but the expectation of your success would then be 18 or more correct. Of course, you are free to perform this test as many times as you wish, at convenient intervals for all concerned. Some parameters may change, in that case. I await your comments....

Excellent! Let us have the tests that you yourself suggested, using the equipment you approved, be carried out as soon as possible, so your claim for the million-dollar prize may be established.

If you would like to try Penta and have it tested please send me your address and I will send you a sample. Feel free to take it to any University and have them do a mass spec. direct liquid inject or Infrared spectroscope.

I fear that you are out of your depth, Mr. Holloway. The terminology you apply here is gibberish. But, I repeat: we will accept any means you specify to differentiate between Penta water and ordinary water.

Dear Doctor:
Water is EXTREMELY complex and the top researcher in the world is my neighbor, William Tiller. He has just completed more research, which I have not yet been privy to, so we are all just students.

In that spirit please enjoy this contribution by one of our discussion group members. The owner of Penta Water, Bill Holloway, has turned down big bucks from big Pharma as his water permits certain of their work to proceed FAR MORE EFFICIENTLY than otherwise possible. So they PAY HIM the $400. a bottle he gets for the ULTRA PENTA water. Nonetheless, like all small companies, he apparently does not keep everyone happy nor jumps to do every study that some "critics" might request of him.

I have spent days working with leading scientists and I am convinced PENTA water is different. No distilled or other type of water that I have PERSONALLY tested on others and myself moves the BIOIMPEDENCE ANALYSIS test as rapidly or as far as PENTA water. To me this means it somehow increased INTRACELLULAR water levels, which I can only see as a benefit. I know that the research on survival time of donor hearts after they are out of the donor and being transported seems to only be increased significantly with even a more advanced version of ULTRA PENTA water not available to us since this costs $400. a bottle.

I am convinced PENTA is onto something, but I will also agree that there will be other very useful water products to fill other needs. This is not the only useful water around, and for specific indications as in renal failure, the NARIWA water from Japan looks very good. I use acid/alkaline devices from Japan and the NIKKEN water purification where they have a device like an osterizer that alters the water.

If the first stage of our work with chelation is primarily DETOXIFICATION, and if we get more water INTRACELLULAR and the BIA device is from RJL and they are the authorities on this equipment, which is used in intensive care wards extensively, then for THAT indication, MORE INTRACELLULAR water, PENTA seems warranted. However, for my ultimate source of water for longevity, I am out there with Ponce De Leon, still looking.

Sincerely,
Garry F. Gordon, MD,DO,MD(H)

You are about to visit a third-party site. We are not responsible for the information contained on third-party sites. Do you wish to continue?